SkyHarvest

About lumens....seems to me "lumens" is the light that fits a spectrum profile we can best see by, the lumens by which plants "best grow by" being something often entirely diferent. Surpising they don't come out with a "lumen" system designed for horticulture but then again, each plant probably grows best under a slightly different profile. I'd love to see some of the masters come out with a cannibis profile/lumen system and conversion tables from standard lumens to it.

The only thing I can see EVL's doing better than HIDs is the fuller spectrum but EYE is coming out with a 92cri 200k lumen MH that should put evls away in the cri department and HPS away in the lumens department, BUT it has a higher color tempature than either. ugh.

About the price of EVL's...price is a big factor when considering all of this. As I've said elsewhere, I would take 20 EVLs over 1 1k HPS but look at the price difference.

In any case I think a diverse mixture of lights is best- MH HPS and EVLs altogether, but thats bucks. The search for the elusive "overall ideal light" continues......

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"They're trying to build a prison, for you and me to live in, for you and me"--System of a Down

choader

and I'll say it again. The search for the "perfect" light is fruitless. There is no "one" answer. Too many factors play into it: price, space size, heat exchange ability, grow style (just to name a few).

IMHO, the trick is to find the balance between the factors in YOUR specific situation, then pick the best solution. There is no free lunch. It is largely a zero sum game. When you push on one thing, something else pops out which needs to be solved.

The discussion here is great! It highlights the strengths and weaknesses of each light, within different applications, to help us make the right decision for us.

My hats off to mist, Jose, et. al. for their work and contributions. I have benefited greatly and chose 2 fluorex lights for my space. It was the right solution point, at this time, for my specific situation. You can see pics in my journal.

Good luck all.

Choader

JoseHempSeed

very well put, choader. the best light is very dependent on the grower - his circumstances and budget and expectations and...
good luck with your grow

hey SkyHarvest, there IS a better system for horticultural light measurement - it's called PAR (photosynthetically active radiation, i think), anyway it is a measurement of light intensity between 400 and 700 nm, and takes into account the quantum efficiency of photons (really, no shyte) in the photosyntetic process. there's tons of stuff on it around the net. li-cor has great technical docs on PAR, but you can only get them by mail.

only problem is, PAR is not widely accepted, at least yet, especially by vendors that DON'T want a decent comparison. most of the more reputable lamp manufactures use it, though.

SkyHarvest

Thanks Jose...do you use PAR? I want to see some of the proven master growers (delta, ozgrower etc etc) use it as a standard before I do. Not tryin to leave anyone out of that list, those two just spring first to mind. Also, as debatable as it is, UV plays a role in MJ's manufacture of cannabanoids and really shoulden't be left out of the spectrum so to speak. PAR definitely doesn't take that into consideration. Maybe a cannabis-specific system would work well. Not tryin to split hairs, just pointing out how far we still have to go before we even have the best possible way to quantify light for MJ growing. The lumen system is definitely outdated and PAR seems a step closer...I'll have to read up on it, thanks.

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papadanknc420

Mist,
It would really be cool if your right!! lol. The only reason my garden is not running as we speak is because of heat issues. I'm sure those must run cooler than HID lighting. For some reason, i follow the Ed Rosenthal school of thought about intensity. How do they compare to HID's when it comes to intensity?
papa

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Afghani/Skunk

choader

I'm off my soapbox now. Too many moving parts to consider. If money and heat were no object, that's another topic.

Hope things are well with you.

Choader

Agent86

For those of you who haven't checked out my grow journal. I'm using 2, Full Spectrum 95 watt EVLs & 2, Red Spectrum 95 watt EVLs.
I keep them 3" from the top of my plants & have no heat problems.
So if you want to see what EVLs are capable of, go check out my grow. I'm currently at day 20 of 12/12.

Later Grow Bros.
86.

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JoseHempSeed

hey SkyHarvest,
right on about the UV and PAR. PAR doesn't include UV at all. i think that's mainly because UV detectors and sensors are difficult to manufacture and expensive to buy.
my WORST outdoor grow is much better than my BEST indoor grow. and i attribute that to UV, but that's the rub - there's no real way to quantify it because i can't measure it
anyway, El Sol is certainly the absolute, best growlight there is. i haven't come across anyone who'll argue that

SkyHarvest

Jose...your absolutely right, nothing better than the actual sun. I know so little about all of this but it seems like a biological UV meter should be possible if someone could determine exactly how UV affects a certain plant species in a measurable way. From there at least some kind of UV system could be worked out and lights rated, at least for us MJ growers. Gotta be someway, even if its not biological but anything that changes in a way that can be accurately measured could be used. If only one of us got a hold of a UV meter and did a series of tests under the proper controls the exact amount of UV needed and what it does for MJ could be figured out and published along with how much UV each type of light puts out. I'd buy that book.

__________________
"They're trying to build a prison, for you and me to live in, for you and me"--System of a Down

Xzoomd

You may want to get ahold of a UVA-UVB radiometer..Optix is one company that makes 'em.

Zoomy