cidium

I’m starting this thread for people like me who are interested in alternative types of indoor lighting. The basic light bulb really hasn’t changed much since it was invented, but advancements in the way the light bulb makes light have changed. Although HID is still the main stay for indoor growing compact fluorescent lighting is quickly giving the old workhorse HID a run for their money. Beyond conventual lighting there seems to be new and exciting methods of producing light on the consumer horizon. As a starting point I would like to talk about daylight transmission methods as a secondary source of indoor lighting. I say secondary since even nature can’t supply 100% of the light one would need to grow indoors. With longer growing periods and cloudy days daylight transmission systems need to supplement an electrical lighting system.

I have been looking at fiber optics as a method of transmission, there seems to be some really interesting work done on this idea. The main leader in this idea would be La Foret Engineering. In 1978 they founded and developed a sunlight collection system that was computer controlled to track the sun all day long to maximize the collection of the sun’s rays. Their latest model XD-100S is solar powered and transmits a maximum of 9,800 lumens. Here’s the best part of this, it’s free to operate, as long as the sun shines you have free lighting.

Nominal operating distance for the fiber optic cable is 45 feet, but with anything too good to be true there is line loss in the fiber optic cables. Prices range in the hundred of thousands for the largest model to several thousand for the smaller ones. The fiber optic cable is sold per meter and there are several lighting appliances that attach to the cable for sale.


For anyone interested in this product use this search phrase:

Laforet Engineering Co., Ltd.

Or

Himawari

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grass_hopper

Sounds interesting. I have read something about these. Kinda sux on cloudy days, but would work if you had some sort of photovoltaic rig. So on the spectrum that you described, what would a one-room, high lumen setup cost?

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cidium

From the information I have on this product the smallest unit, the one I posted, has a max output of 9800 lumens and cost as of 2001 prices 4000.00 clam-O-las :::OUCH::: The fiber optic cable is charged by the meter at 140.00 clams and the fixtures for indoor run from 30.00 to 240.00. As to the cloudy days the unit is computer controlled so as the sun moves it moves along with it, as the sun pokes out its head from behind a cloud there is the array to collect. It's all automated to return to the morning position when the sun goes down ready and waiting for the morning sun. So as I said , this type of lighting would be a second source of light to an already exsisting source. In all honesty if the prices are still that high I don't see spending 4500.00 bucks for 9800 lumes the return time on your money would take forever. The best feature about this system is where ever you could run the fiber optic you could have natural sunlight. If you use the search phrase you can go to the manufacture's website and get all the details - they post no prices there.

cidium

Yeah S2 you are right there is a reduction in transmission of visible light and the infrared and ultra violet. The biggest thing I noticed is this company was launched in 1978 and with almost 30 years behind this concept there really hasn’t been any big breakthroughs in price reduction. I think the idea is a good one like all other alternative sources of energy they are going to dip deep into your wallet.

Cool, see I was going to lead this thread into all the different types of alternative light like led's and such. I have seen some promising led arrays that are spectrum adjustable - Now that's cool!

grass_hopper

Sunpipes are probably as or more effective for attic grows. You've got me thinking about this little unit for my new house

dubya dubya dubya dot sunpipe dot com



The largest unit (double the number from what the chart says) with a 4' long pipe claims to emit about 700 foot candles on a sunny day at noon. They advertise that 14 FC = to 100 watts of lightbulb output. Unless my math is wrong would be the equivalent of 5000 watts of lightbulbs!

700 / 14 * 100 = 5000



The best thing - a 4' x 21" rig has a MSRP of ~$900. Even compared to a couple of 1000w HIDs, the energy consumption over a 10 hr day, the payback would be pretty quick.

If you limited your grow to only to the summer it would be comparable to an outdoor grow. If you wanted to use that space to grow offseason with the sunpipe as a supplemental light source, the equation gets a little more tricky.

The only problems would be maintaining a consistent "day" length to not induce flowering prematurely when growing off season, and shielding the light coming out of the dome at night when lengthening the grow time.

Interesting idea though - anyone using these sunpipes?

__________________
"Do not walk behind me, for I may not lead. Do not walk in front of me, for I may not follow. Do not walk beside me either. Just pretty much leave me the hell alone."


Ancient History:
Blueberry/Mazar (started in hydro, moved outdoors)...Skunk#1/Blueberry in Soil
Botanicare 42 Site Cloner - a Review...Grass_Hopper's Butane Honey Oil (BHO) Thread

Website goodies:
Grow Guide...Cecil_B's CO2 Enrichment Guide...Grower's Dictionary...Getting Females From Standard Seeds

Mendrel

Wouldn't be too hard, just rig up a curtain to block out the light on a timer. They make commercial sunshades for greenhouse use, I'm sure we could rig sumpthin up.

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cidium

HID ballast for PV applications


The UK-based company Antares has developed a highly efficient electronic ballast for small high-intensity discharge (HID) lamps intended for use in combination with photovoltaics (PVs). The ballast was developed for the UK lighthouse authority Trinity House as part of a long-term lighthouse automation project.

The new ballast works on solid-state, single-stage conversion, and the manufacturer claims very low losses, i.e. not more than 10% of the lamp power. With a 35-W metal-halide lamp, the additional losses are only about 3W, and with a 70-W lamp not more than 7W. One ends up with a total system power consumption of 38-39 W and 77-78W respectively. Although this is lower than for standard HID ballasts for alternating current (AC) applications, it is even more interesting to compare the new ballasts with other HID ballasts for PV systems.

Typically, the latter ballasts are based on two-stage conversion. First, the low-voltage, direct current (DC) from the PV array is converted into high-voltage DC and then from DC to AC to drive the lamp. Losses can be great, especially in the DC-to-AC conversion, and the total power consumption of the conversion unit and lamp driver can be as high as the lamp power itself. Thus, a 35-W metal-halide lamp could need an additional 35 W for the power supply!

However, the new ballast is probably not the answer to the needs of the typical designer of PV-lighting systems. Since the ballast is designed for extreme efficiency and must meet very tough environmental and reliability requirements, component quality has not been the least bit compromised, according to the manufacturer. This emphasis on high quality in combination with small production volumes has resulted in a very high price of ~£500 (~US$ 700). The manufacturer claims that the extreme efficiency and high price were the result of careful consideration on behalf of the specifier, Trinity House. It was possible to establish a positive tradeoff in spite of the price since money can be saved on battery storage and PV arrays.

According to the manufacturer, if slight reductions in reliability and efficiency could be accepted, the technology could be made cheaper. For instance, Antares believes they could produce a similar ballast for the automotive industry at a cost of £70-140 if sales volumes in the thousands could be achieved.

Nils Borg

Contact:

Graham Young
Antares (Europe) Ltd.
Chiltern Hill, Chalfont, St. Peter
Gerrards Cross, Bucks SL9 9UQ, UK
Tel: + 44 1753 89 08 88
Fax: + 44 1753 89 12 60

cidium

From SC Solar one could have a true PV powered HID light. These units come configured as a conventual street light with all the components attached to a single upright. As you can see from the picture reconfiguring the light head to be remote located should be fairly easy. I have no information on the price of this unit as the website asks for potential costumer to call. In comparison to the fiber optic system by Laforet Engineering Co., SC Solar system produces 3,600 lumens. What should be considered is the PV powered system is influenced by clouds or weather but has reserve power via battery.

Use X-35 SC Solar as a search phase

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grass_hopper

I priced out a PV solar system for my old house, which was perfect because the main part of the roof faced the right direction exactly so the panels could lay flat. The panels, inverter, and setup etc. was about 5,000 for a 1.5kw installation. If you made more power than you use, you could actually sell it back to the grid. The sales guy told me I'd be able to watch the dial on the meter running backwards when I was selling power instead of buying it. I didn't tell him that I planned to use all that juice and then some.

The problem is that this pricing was with grants from the federal government that expired at the beginning of the year (so I'm told). The grants were for 50% of the installation cost - can you imagine! Why the hell didn't everyone get one of these - esp. out here where power is pushing $.07/khw! I think it's part of a conspiracy - pass a program through legislation but then don't tell anyone about it

Anyway, the position is moot because in my new house the roof is 90° the wrong direction, so I'd need big brackets etc. on my roof. Not going to happen.

__________________
"Do not walk behind me, for I may not lead. Do not walk in front of me, for I may not follow. Do not walk beside me either. Just pretty much leave me the hell alone."


Ancient History:
Blueberry/Mazar (started in hydro, moved outdoors)...Skunk#1/Blueberry in Soil
Botanicare 42 Site Cloner - a Review...Grass_Hopper's Butane Honey Oil (BHO) Thread

Website goodies:
Grow Guide...Cecil_B's CO2 Enrichment Guide...Grower's Dictionary...Getting Females From Standard Seeds

cidium

This lighting system shows some promise in being the all-in-one light for indoor growing. The price for the base unit is 495.00 clams and extra light strips are 295.00 bucks. I think the price is still too high, but with all new things they tend to come down in price over time.

GrowLush LED plant growth lighting systems are designed with highest reliability, efficiency and versatility in mind. Durable water-tight construction insures reliable operation year after year in wet environments. Low power consumption allows high productivity indoor gardening or supplemental greenhouse lighting with no modifications to electrical system. Modular design allows up to four LED Lighting Strips to be operated from a single Power Module. Heavy duty components resist damage in harsh operating conditions.

High energy 3rd generation LEDs.. make grow lights practical
Adjustable spectrum for seedlings, growth, and flowering
No annual bulb replacements
Ultra-Low Power consumption - 25Watts per light strip
No specialized cooling systems required
Up to four light strips per power module
Highest Quality Components insures Longest Life
All Patent Pending technology

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