milsurp

Can clone foliage grow *too* fast? I had a setback and had to clone the two surviving females of my first grow. All that I expected to survive, did - 6 total. We are about three weeks along now.

Two "main stem" clones have looked strong and dark green all along (I don't know how they did it??). Their growth has been very measured and slow and steady. They are the hairiest of the bunch (mother plants were just starting to kick in some bud production).

Two of the others have struggled a bit and are now "semi-exploding".

Two of them have made my jaw drop. They looked a bit pitiful for a week and a half, then started growing - FAST. They are only about 7" tall, but the fan leaves, especially on top, are as big as my hand (I'm a pretty big guy)!!!!!!!!!

I don't think there is any way the roots could be matching this growth rate, could they?

The exploders and semi-exploders all have top leaves that are "V" shaped. The top leaves are also starting to wrinkle and look leathery. The semi-exploders also have interveinal chlorosis.

The two main stem lush green clones have no such symptoms.


good bagseed

ebb & flow - clones in rockwool, clay pellets

30-45% RH

80-87 deg F during lights on, 75-80 deg F during lights off

400 hps hortilux in 2x3' well ventilated closet - average 20 on, 4 off

pH - 5.4-6.1

1250 ppm using reverse osmosis drinking water with about 10% tap (I throw the tap in for some trace minerals and I've never had a prob with my tap water, even using it straight. It's 220 ppm out of the faucet - tastes good. Maybe I'm wasting my money on the RO water - who knows? Peace of mind.

GH flora series - have worked up to "transition to flower" stage - scheduled 15 min on, 45 min off - just put in fresh nutes today after 1 day of flushing with pH adjusted tap, a leftover cup of fresh seedling fert, and a few oz of h2o2. The two runts (semi-exploders) seemed to like the flush the most. The others were kind of indifferent to the flush - at least to my eye.

*note - Only three additions/changes to GH flora series have been made.

#1 has been a few drops of Green Light Iron and Soil Acidifier when the plants were new - it's chelated iron, zinc, copper, sulpher and manganese (IIRC) at 0-0-0. I was only guessing it might help with yellowing. It was added to the res when the clones got their real first "feed" at about 7-10 days - right after moving them from dixie cups into the ebb & flow. As an aside, this prevented me from having to add pH down too. This was used sparingly in feeding #2 and has not been used since then.

Addition #2 is the addition of SuperThrive at every feeding at a rate of approx .75 ml per G.

#3 has been just a pinch-1/4 tsp to the whole ten G res- of epsom salts during the last two feeds (it was a suggestion). I did not add ES to the fresh nutes I just mixed. Figured I'd post here first and solicit suggestions.


Soliciting suggestions.

Thanks

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n_d_shadows

The plant will not grow beyond its roots ability to support the growth. Simply put if they are growing that fast and that good, dont stress it at all. just means healthy/happy plants.

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MoSnazzy

Did you say that your new growth is starting wrinkle and look leathery?? Maybe a pic would help...

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I like to spend most of my time on this in the woods on a 12" wide, twisty, bumpy, jumpy trail going 20 mph...and thats where I'll be when I fire up the green that I grow.


HEY...yeah you. Is that weed?? You shouldn't be smoking that stuff. Here, give it to me...I'll take care of it.

Must have patience to grow a nice plant; Elevated you shall be (yoda)

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Milagro's Bike

milsurp

Thanks for the fast reply, gents!

Sorry - no digicam.

The upper growth has that classic "V". Is that the "praying for magnesium" that I hear about?

When I say "leathery", I mean a somewhat to very mottled color, with a pebble like texture to it, with wavy edges - that's what the "leathery" leaves look like.

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MoSnazzy

Ok... I thought you meant that it looked bad and I had never heard anybody else describe it like you did. Anyway, except for the chlorosis, sounds like you have some healthy plants. Is the "V" shape coming from where the flower is forming. If so I believe thats normal, otherwise someone else will have to answer.

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I like to spend most of my time on this in the woods on a 12" wide, twisty, bumpy, jumpy trail going 20 mph...and thats where I'll be when I fire up the green that I grow.


HEY...yeah you. Is that weed?? You shouldn't be smoking that stuff. Here, give it to me...I'll take care of it.

Must have patience to grow a nice plant; Elevated you shall be (yoda)

Ever notice that when you concentrate on a solution for a problem, the problem goes away?? But when you concentrate on the problem people start to place blame.

Check out what people are saying about this place

Milagro's Bike

milsurp

"V" is the leaf shape as viewed from the tip. I don't want to throw in mg and throw something else out of whack. Better to find out/ask first.

If it works, here's a perfect pic from another thread, thanks to hydroguy.

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milsurp

Just checked - the above pic is a pretty accurate depiction of my middle sized plants - the semi-exdploders.

The two big girls have no chlorosis, but their leaves are folded up almost in half!!!!!!!! Why??? Leaves also seem to be super long/stretched. Maybe that's an optical illusion from them being folded up. Again - I believe all environmental conditions are good.

I added 1 tsp epsom salts to the 6+ G I have in the res. Will check very carefully if this helps/hurts.

Any further input appreciated.

For the time being, I want to concentrate only on getting the leaves of the two monsters straightened out. Will be reducing light in about 2 days in order to bloom. These two are quick climbers. Stalks are about 3/8 thick - short, stout, loooong folded leaf girls that are booming. I want to treat them right!

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n_d_shadows

after seeing the pic MG is the first thing that came to mind. sounds like you should be on the right track with your fix. GL

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milsurp

Added two more tsp of epsome salts and moved my light up 1.5". No classic signs of heat stress and the cab is around 82.5 deg F @ 40% RH.

It's raining here now, so I'm gonna go shut down the lights for an hour or so and mist these babies. A hint of everything in the quart sprayer - two drops of Green Light Iron & Acidifier (iron, zinc, copper, sulpher), two drops of each of the three part GH floras, and 1/4 tsp epsom salts. Turns out to be about 220 ppm. pH of spray is 6.2-6.5.

***One of the mid-sized plants is now showing a reddish /dark gray bug necrotic patch in the center of its two biggest fan leaves.

Again - the folding up of the leaves on the big girls are on the upper, not lower leaves, and the leaves are huge and seem to be elongated.


Thanks for the suggestions!

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milsurp

OK - I had worried about this for a week. Added this and that after flushing and had a hodgepodge of gh flora, Green Light Iron & Acidifier, pureblend grow addative, superthrive, hydroguard, Epsom salts, and as of yesterday, some Cal-Mag. All in ro water. jeeeeeez that's a bunch of stuff.......

Plants were looking worse today with top growth wilty and limp - yellowing slightly on brand new growth. Top fan leaves on the two big girls rolling up badly and leathery looking - puffed up in between the veins - same issue to a lesser degree on the smaller girls.

I swear, I just sat there and thought about what I'd been adding. Mostly "secondary" nutes. All I knew was that the things looked great on the bottom - meaning no cal or mag or nit problems (I tried the cal-mag on advice from a grow shop employee - hey, I had to try something). Anyway, they looked green, but hadn't been given an abundance of the "big three", so I started looking through the products on hand to see what had lots of P and K, but little N and little micros.

Read the label on my box of GH Kool-Bloom - butloads of P and K - little N and micros in comparrison. Decided to give it a try and mixed it in at 1/2 recommended strength. Ph was at 5.8-9. Dropped it to 5.6 and left the house.

Seven hours later - man, what a difference! Kool-Bloom to the rescue!

Leaves are much less rolled, new growth is greening nicely and saluting proudly!

Just thought I'd share what SEEMS to be a resolution to my problem. Don't forget the P & K - even during veg/beginning of flower!

If I am off track here, then set me straight, but my plants look a heck of a lot better.

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