KarmasPayment

ahhh always good to see a great thread resurface. The soil mix we used this time was quite interesting. The soil looked something like this.

1 part perlite
1 part vemiculite (#4)
1.5 part soil
.5 part earthworm castings

The result of this was that water was not being retained at all. Early on there was some water retention, but as we approached flowering the soil was drying out daily. With this sudden influx of water the plants went from 8 inches to 3.5 feet. So what I have been trying to find out is if water retention is a good thing? I also am hoping to find the differences between potting soil and top soil. Anyone know what the big differences are? I am gonna go try and look it up.

KP

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smelly

my first try at useing a soil mix as compared to just planting in pure pro-mix BX - here is my mix

15gal perlite
5gal worm casting
5gal oraganic compost
5gal soil (promix for me)
4cup kelp meal
2cup blood meal
2cup guano (13-0-0)
1cup green sand quick release(0-0-17)
1/2cup sul-po-mag - qustion here - should i grind it finer than i got it - it seamed coarse to me

i mix and then let sit for a whole - min 2 weeks - unless an emergency - i just started with this mix and have only transtplanted into it when going into flower - i am planning on cloneing in the next day or to to see how it works - i am going to cloneinto rockwool cubes as i ususaly do - then i am going to go to a small plasic cup with just perlite/vermiculite and some wc - does this sound good - i am probably also going to do some in just pro-mix so i dont lose them all - but if all goes well i will be able to try out this new soil mix from the get go - i am kinda scared about transplanting them to ti to earlie and killin' em' - but i want to maximise the sort time i keep them in veg - -- sorry for rambeling - but if you have any suggestions on my problems or hoe to better ether of my soil mix's - thanks a ton - peace

Lizzie Borden

Topsoil is basically just dirt. Few growers use it. Potting soil is a mix of various things, such as peat moss, compost, perlite, vermiculite, lime, etc., to make it suitable for potted plants.

Smelly -- are you sure that guano is 13-0-0, and not 0-13-0? Assuming it's 0-13-0, your soil mix sounds excellent for a plant to veg and then flower in. For just flowering, you should reduce the blood meal by half or so. Perlite/vermiculite/wc should work great to clone in. I've used all kinds of things, including my regular soil mix. Medium doesn't seem to be that important if the other conditions (mainly humidity) are right. You can put clones in your nutrient-enriched mix as soon as they have a good set of roots and are showing new growth.

My sul-po-mag is coarse too, like large crystals. Grinding it would probably help it get broken down faster, but I use it as is.

smelly

yeah 0-13-0 - i am still confused about what is soil - O well i am going with the mix i have for a grow or two and then reformulate it as i see need - thanks a ton - peace

organic

that sounds like a well thought out mixture but I am a little concerned it might be a little too hot - a little too much N and maybe K. Then again it might turn out not to be, depending on the strain, etc.


The dictionary definition for soil I found says that it is the top layer of the earth's crust, suitable for plant growth. Which is a good general thought to keep in mind when constructing it.

Another definition of soil more suited for our purposes here is an intricate mix of fine rock particles, organic matter, water, air, microorganisms, and other animals.
A healthy soil is full of living things: plant roots, animals, insects, bacteria, fungi, and other organisms.
Rodale's All New Encyclopedia of Organic Gardening.

Now obviously, this definition pertains more to outside conditions, but replicating the system as thoroughly as is practicable indoor gives you healthier plants. With that in mind, the addition of organic matter, compost and/or worm castings (to populate the soil with biological components), and rock minerals to the soil are probably the most important factors in getting the most out of an indoor organic-based soil.

Well, that's how the theory goes anyway.

O

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smelly

when makeing the mix i was thinking i might be a little high on K - but i have read that it is hard to overdo it on K - and that i should be looking any signs of K toxcitiy - i was thinking my N was in good line though - i will keep an eye on that also - i guess i should make a flowering mix now also with less N in it - correct me if i am wrong but to much N dureing flowering will lead to a more green flavor in the finished herb - and that why the leaves should turn yellow the last couple of weeks - ?? - thanks a ton for all of the advice - peace

organic

The idea is to get the plant to use up as much N as possible without starving it too much during flower. So it's not bad to have some N still going during flower, you just want to make sure there's not too much of it.

The soil mix you made up will be fine for the length of the grow - no need to make a different flowering mix. The only reason to worry about too much N as I cautioned earlier is in the early stages of the grow when the plants are small; they can get burnt if there's too much N, and some strains are more sensitive than others. But the amount you put in is not so much that you'll be overloading them during flower - it should get used up as the plant grows.

If you just keep an eye on the N & K, you'll be fine.

Glad to help
O

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organic

The original thread can be found here

G'Day,

Here then is my secret formula for dynamite potting soil which will keep your potted plants fresh, healthy and exuberant under these conditions with a minimum of work and trouble. The secret ingredient is "duff", it makes all the difference. Now, for those who do not know what "duff" is, it is the stuff you find on the forest floor - the surface layer of semi-decayed leaves and needles among the trees.

Start out with good quality potting soil, and add by volume, an equal amount of duff. Then add a handful of sand per gallon, a handful of dolomite lime to balance the pH and for its vital trace elements, and up to a quart of finished compost or composted manure. For good measure, work in a handful of finely shredded seaweed per gallon, and dust the whole thing with a tablespoon of 20-20-20 slow release fertiliser.

The roughness of the duff will allow plenty of air penetration, but will also hold water like a super-sponge. It's the equivalent of a super absorbent sponge with lots of small holes in it. And that is exactly what our potted plants need. A plentiful reservoir of moisture, along with well aerated soil. The handful of sand worked into a gallon of this soil is also necessary to provide ready drainage, particularly later in the season when it gets wet again. It prevents the soil from becoming water logged. And the high nitrogen, phosphorus and potash fertilizer provides plenty of nitrogen for growth and the ongoing decay of the duff, while the phosphorus is needed for the demands of profuse blossoms.

It is best to make this potting soil at least a week in advance, so all its ingredients can become well acquainted with each other. When using this soil in suspended planters and hanging baskets, make sure they are on sturdy supports. For when this soil is nicely saturated with water it weighs a ton. And this is exactly how it should be. Test for watering by lifting the pot or planter a bit. If it doesn't 'weigh a ton' it needs water. Plastic pots help a great deal by preventing evaporation through the sides of these totally exposed containers, and so does a clear plastic liner in wood and porous ceramic pots and planters.

Under normal circumstances, and with evaporation through the sides of the container minimized, you'll find that you need to water your pots only about once a week, and all of your flowers will just love it.
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3hounds :

Round here we call "duff" leaf mold, or "mostly" composted leaves... a great magnesium source. If you are lucky enough to live somewhere that it is available, go for it. You can make your own with shredded leaves, water, and a garbage bag, but it takes months.
I would definitely recommend adding lots of perlite to that mix if cannabis is your crop. Leaf mold holds a ton of water, and as overwatering is about the most common newbie mistake, we avoid it every way possible.

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REALTR33

here in the south we call "duff"-humus. its that rather thick layer of mostly decayed leaf matter and dark wet soil. i can usually find it under pine trees in these parts so its pretty acidic. do you ever see smaller vegataton on the floor of a pine forest? NO, b/c pine needles are very acidic and as they decay into this humus they choke out all unadapted plant species. it would be good to mix in to lower the pH of a soil mix, but like you said it holds a ton of water so mix in alot of perlite. i have used it in the veggie garden for as long as i could remember, to keep moisture in. we used to mix it in the top layer of the soil and cake a layer of it on top of the surface. i find it works great...

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